Report from the Select Committee on Contagious Diseases Acts, together with the proceedings of the committee, minutes of evidence, and appendix, 1882.

Great Britain. Parliament. House of Commons. Select Committee on the Contagious Diseases Acts.

Date:: 1882

Credit: Report from the Select Committee on Contagious Diseases Acts, together with the proceedings of the committee, minutes of evidence, and appendix, 1882. Source: Wellcome Collection.

Provider: This material has been provided by the Augustus C. Long Health Sciences Library at Columbia University and Columbia University Libraries/Information Services, through the Medical Heritage Library. The original may be consulted at the the Augustus C. Long Health Sciences Library at Columbia University and Columbia University.

143/882 (page 29)

$17 March 1882.] Captain Betjtton. \_Continued. Mr. Stansfeld—continued. 716. Then your proceeding would not have been against the girls themselves ?—No, my ar- gument is, that if they had been prostitutes, I should have had no difficulty in shutting up the houses ; but as they were not prostitutes I failed, and it was only at the annual licensing meeting that I was able to shut them up. 717. I suppose that their behaviour, within your knowledge inside those '■' free-and-easies,' and sometimes outside, was such as to leave no doubt of their character ?—Xo question about it. It was proved in court not long ago, that on one occasion, after coming out of one of those houses, one of those persons who was alleged to be re- spectable, took up all her clothes in the middle -of the street and danced. 718. Can you tell us anything of their conduct within those places of amusement?—Their be- haviour with soldiers and sailors was, in the ■opinion of those who gave evidence at the time, Avhat no prostitute would do in public. 719. I think you have told us already that one consequence of these proceedings of yours was a gteat reduction, in the year 1881 as com- pared with 1880, in the number of convictions of women for disorderly conduct?—In the year 1880. I think there were 110; and in 1881 there were 66. 720. In those cases was tliere an appeal to the Quarter Sessions?—There was; that is to say, in five of them. 721. In any of those cases was Inspector An- niss appealed to to give any information in his power as to whether the women present were women on the register, or not ?—I can only ejieak from hearsay, from what I was told by the magis- trates' clerk. On the occasion of the appeal to Quarter Sessions Inspector Anniss was asked by the clerk to the justices if he could furnish evi- dence as to the character of those women ; par- ticularly with reference to one house that was most notorious. His reply was, that he could prove nothing. 722. \Vas that the very house out of which the woman came and danced with her clothes up in the open street ?—That is the hou<e. 723. Then I may infer, I take it, from the evi- dence which you have just given us, that you would regard Inspector Auniss's estimate of 40 clandestine prostitutes as the number in the De- vonport district as being, shall I say, an inaccu- rate or an absurd estimate ?—You might very well say both, I think. 724. You have spoken of these free-and- easies : were there not also occasional balls got up ?—Yes, when I first went there it was a very common thing to have what used to be called balls given at St. George's Hall, where tickets were 2.?. Qd. for a lady and gentleman. Those places were the resort of prostitutes and clandes- tine prostitutes. 725. That is to say, of registered and unregis- tered prostitutes ?—Quite so. We have known ab many as 24 registered prostitutes to be present at those balls at one time. 726. What action have you taken with regard to those balls ?—I have opposed the granting of those licenses on every possible occasion. 727. With what results?—The consequence is that> the justices have refused to grant occasional 0.75. Mr. Stansfeld—continued, licenses to (hose places, without there Is a guar- antee of their respectability. I might be asked why [ did not proceed under the Licensing Act. I did on one occasion, and I was met by the solicitor who defended. I was called upon to prove that it was an habitual resort of prostitutes. That I could prove, but as these occasional licenses were not granted to the same individual, but each man has his own license, I failed in that, because, although it was the habitual resoit of prostitutes, I could not prove that it was within the knowledge of this particular individual that it was. There was no defence whatever as to the character of the women. 727*. I presume, therefore, that you are not prepared to admit the truth of the statement of Inspector Anniss, in ans^ver to Question 3240, that the local police would not interfere with immoral practices ?—It is the very reverse. He says: The police do not interfere inside a house unless they are called in. We must not expect too much, I am afraid, from the police. If there is noise or disorder, the police are called in, and they see what is going on inside of that house, and take action thereon. 728. You do not accept that as a correct in- terpretation of your functions, or of the way in which you have exercised them?—Certainly not. 729. And you say that your evidence to-day disproves the correctness of that statement ?—The facts that I give the Committee and the convic- tions prove that. 730. Now would you turn to Question and Answer 4249, and tell us what Inspector Anniss there states?—He is asked: 'With regard to the borough and metropolitan ])olice, in what respects would you contend that the metropolitan police were for the purposes of carrying out these Acts, or for the purposes connected with these Acts, superior or likely to have or to be able to obtain better information upon the subject of the Acts V' And his answer is: '' In the first place, we are entirely independent of all local influence.' 731. In the first place, I will ask you whether you are independent of all local influence .'— Yes. 732. You can give us, I take it, some other reason for your independence than the fact (which I should not doubt) that you would not choose to be subservient to such an influence ?—My position is entirely independent of any local influence. I see that, in answer to another question, Inspector Anniss says, that we are under what they call a watch committee. I have no watch committee. All informations, all the summonses, all police proceedings, are initiated by myself, entirely in- dependent of any one- I am responsible solely to the county authorities. The public possibly do not understand what the gentlemen here would understand. Innuendoes have been thrown out against the local police which are not justified; and I think you will allow that I am right in repudiating them, 733. Going back to the last subject that we discussed, viz.. Inspector Anniss's opinion that the local police do not interfere with immoral practices ; they do not go into a house unless they are called in in case of disorder ?— \Vc have no power to do so. D 3 734. But$